Oceans Yet to Burn

ranma-official

millennial-review

ranma-official

she’s most likely an instagram star or about to receive a huge allowance, but I choose to interpret this as her planning to kill her parents for inheritance

mitigatedchaos

The claim that the average Capitalism has over 3,000 efficiencies is a statistical error. The typical Capitalism has 3 efficiencies. Posthuman Hypercapitalism, which is instantiated only in the Post-Yudkowskyian Dream Timeline, produces over 3,000,000 efficiencies per day through retroactive quantum precognition and wordline branch prediction. It is an outlier, and should not be counted.

Source: millennial-review shtpost chronofelony

collapsedsquid

mitigatedchaos

Quite simply, I disagree. I don’t think Rotherham is ordinary crime. Culture has an effect. (Also keeping mind that whites are the majority of the country. 9/11 has a pretty big effect relative to population.) And like I said, “things are bad” isn’t a reason to make them worse.

Of course, if terrorist incidents are considered too rare to count, what about mass/rampage shootings generally? How do you feel about the 2nd Amendment?

Unfortunately there’s no practical reversing immigration, and if I’m right and you’re wrong, I receive no compensation.

As for the right-wing militias, it would be best if the Left/Libs weren’t actively doing things which contributed to their recruitment (and instead kept them to the minimum natural size these things tend to reach), like openly celebrating “demographic destiny”. But I suppose that’s like asking for the US to GTFO of the Middle East to stop contributing to the bullsht there resulting in more radicalization. It’s dumb, but the combination of factors gives it an inertia that’s difficult to stop.

testblogdontupvote

mitigatedchaos

I’m in favor of stripping citizenship from people who are convicted of terrorist acts or being a member of organized crime, for those who have citizenship with another country.

I’m also in favor of a more merit-based immigration system which would, coincidentally, be less likely to bring in organized crime, crime generally, and also not create the situation where foreign workers can be brought in to replace an entire division of an American company because the company effectively decides their immigration status on its own whims, and so on.

I consider “I said I was just getting a student visa, but then I got a job and that was extended to a different immigration status” to be a different matter from “I said I wouldn’t practice FGM, but then I did.”

Source: collapsedsquid

discoursedrome

mitigatedchaos

@discoursedrome

so like. this is pretty bad for a lot of reasons but I have to pick one in the interests of economy, so for now I’m just going to focus on the issue that “criminal” and “crime” have the biggest noncentrality problem going. Everyone is a criminal and commits crimes on a daily basis; every adult is a felon who commits felonies at least yearly. The negative associations attached to “crime” and “criminal” only usefully describe a tiny minority of the things that are crimes and people that are criminals under the law (with “criminal scum” being an even smaller category than that). This isn’t just semantic nitpicking in this case, it’s the specific issue under contention.

Right, I don’t actually care about foreign nationals immigrating and then getting speeding tickets. Revoking the citizenship of someone who is a member of a foreign drug cartel or who commits so-called “honor” killings, however, seems reasonable.

The idea was “why bring citizenship into it at all?” and the issue is that an alternative policy where we’re more selective in the first place or impose stiffer penalties is not actually on the table. I don’t want FGM in the country. All the instruments to deal with this are blunt, and some less blunt instruments I’m not allowed to use because I’m not allowed to acknowledge certain realities.

(As an aside, America is wacky in that someone concerned about Turkish nationalism should actually be happy if Turkish American formed a Turkish-nationalist political party that denied the Armenian genocide, since it means they’ll be throwing their votes away in every election. The system works, on account of how broken it is!)

That bit wasn’t about America, as you might have guessed. America isn’t what Erdogan is so hyped about lately.

Edit: I’ll throw on here - culture is not race. I’m not sure if you tagged because you believe it or because someone else does, but culture is not race, and there’s a reason you don’t see me complaining about other groups that have foreign religions and differing skintones. That conflation contributed to covering up mass sexual abuse in the UK, and I will not respect it. I have devalued racism allegations generally by more than half since 2007.

Source: collapsedsquid politics rape cw

collapsedsquid

mitigatedchaos

My point is that there are not Extreme Situations for which the Ordinary Measures don’t work, this is a fairly standard situation that you seem to think deserves extraordinary measures. I do not think it does.
Unless you’re totally throwing out any sort of legal due process for this, not sure how your plan saves the $500,000.

Well if you don’t let them in in the first place, then you don’t end up paying $500,000 to police the crimes they commit. Using the death penalty for this matter should increase the deterrent effect.

This doesn’t seem extreme to you?

And if you want to say it’s because they’re so dangerous and we need to make hardheaded decisions, I could link to any of the articles that are popping up all over the place about how immigrants commit less crimes. You’re just asserting they are making things “worse.“

I’d give good odds that every single one of those articles will conflate different immigrant groups that have different cultures and thus different behaviors. And not just different groups by ethnicity and nationality, but by legal status. I really don’t trust Left/Libs on this matter anymore due to their ideological precommitments and general open borders stance. (After all, “disreputable” sources reported on the Rotherham scandal and were dismissed before it got big. No reason to trust it isn’t being underreported again for the same reasons.)

The word is that no, they’re still not up to the task of actually policing it like you say you want them to.

And so my plan to force assimilation is “wait.“ Worked for the Irish and the Chinese, it’ll work again. , I don’t really think there’s a substantial problem that needs fixing here. To the extent that there could be, I’m not sure why our ordinary legal system can’t handle it.

Irishness isn’t an ideology. Chineseness isn’t an ideology. There is no central book which commands the death penalty for those who leave being Chinese.

And we’re bringing in a million immigrants per year. You say to give it time. So why not, say, halt immigration from select countries and give it some time?

politics

argumate

mugasofer

TIL that the guy who created the Wall Street “charging bull” statue, Arturo Di Modica, still owns it.

He should just move it. It would be hilarious.

shedoesnotcomprehend

Especially if he only moved it, like, ten feet, so that the bull was charging unimpeded while the girl stood defiantly in front of absolutely nothing.

argumate

rotate it 180 degrees, so they’re both facing down some unseen threat

Source: mugasofer shtpost love this plan

collapsedsquid

mitigatedchaos

Hell, why don’t we re-enact Sherman’s march and raze the US south, the southern US is full of shitty people with shitty politics. Maybe burn down all Mormon churches and compounds, they got both nasty shit going on and nasty politics.
I get you wanna piss your fuckin pants because it’s those dirty furriners doing those dirty furriner crimes, but horrible shit didn’t start with immigration and it won’t end when it’s cut off.

Things being bad is not a reason to make them worse. (This part of the problem with arguments about alcohol/drugs, too.)

We have no obligation to import these people. We do not have an obligation to import people that will make the country worse. We don’t have an obligation to tolerate criminal acts favored by their cultures, or tear our national social cohesion to shreds to tolerate those acts.

So some fringe groups of Mormons are still polygamists and practice shady things with young brides and that sort of thing. Oh look, Westerners doing a bad thing. Better import enough people that have similar practices so that it becomes normalized and gains political power! That’ll sure improve things! Yay justice!

but horrible shit didn’t start with immigration and it won’t end when it’s cut off.

How much FGM was happening in the US before it was imported? It won’t stop now if immigration is shut off only because we won’t literally kick all those who practice it out of the country.

Kicking out only individuals who are actually convicted of it is the individualist approach. And it makes sense. The preconditions for citizenship included not bringing foreign criminal/terrorist activity to this country. Those preconditions were violated.

In light of that, how does removing citizenship not make sense?

And I don’t really think the problem we have is “We don’t execute criminals grotesquely enough.“ I think there’s a reason why we don’t do that sort of thing anymore. If you wanted to heighten investigation, that could make sense, but public executions don’t really help anyone.

It apparently cost $500,000 to prosecute three guys, and the number of crimes committed is far worse.

However, “diversity” ideology covered up that the crimes were even happening in the first place. Admitting that some cultures practice this bullsht more than others was “racist”. I mean it’s just economics, right? Cultural differences beyond food aren’t real, right?

What is your plan to force assimilation on this issue?

Maybe we don’t have to publicly execute them. Maybe we can just ordinarily execute them and make sure it gets in the news where their buddies we read it.

Maybe I don’t even want to go that far. Maybe I just want to throw the Overton Window far enough to the right that Cultural Antirealism will die and Left/Libs will at least start admitting that there is a problem and we can get a gentler solution that actually works.

uncharitable politics

collapsedsquid

I remain confused by this idea that “we need to take away their citizenship“ as a punishment or maybe precaution for various things.

Have they committed a crime? Is there going to be some sort of due process? If they have and there is, why isn’t jailing them sufficient? What problem does this solve?

mitigatedchaos

Depends. Whose status is being revoked?

Foreign nationals immigrating to a nation on the pretext that they are not terrorists or criminal scum prove that they lied on their immigration forms by committing crimes, thereby removing the conditions under which citizenship was offered in the first place.

What sacrifices are you willing to make to stop Rotherham? FGM? Acid attacks? Turks creating a political party denying the Armenian Genocide because Erdogan told them to?

collapsedsquid

If they are committing crimes, as mentioned, then as mentioned there is this thing that we’ve invented called “jail.“ Has some problems, but it seems to be the established way to handle this sort of situation. Shouldn’t matter whether they’re Pakistanis, catholic priests or BBC presenters, system should be the same for all of them. Citizenship doesn’t seem to be the issue here.

mitigatedchaos

Don’t be so thickheaded. FGM is a foreign cultural practice that is normalized in certain foreign cultures. You know it. I know it. It isn’t spreading here via internet meme. It’s spreading by migration. We were promised this would not happen.

The way I see it, the rise in this and other foreign-origin crimes has one of three solutions: one, if they want it so badly, we send them back where this bullsht is normal. This the most tolerant. Two, we reestablish by force just who is in charge here. Regular jail is not enough and often in countries in Europe the sentence is far too soft. The men responsible for child rape grooming gangs in England, once convicted, should be hauled in front of the community where they lived, where this behavior was too normalized, and be publicly executed after announcing their identities and crimes in graphic detail for all to hear. Three, we cut off immigration from countries or ethnic groups where this happens for two decades to give society time to actually assimilate them after abolishing the “Cultural Mosaic” model and reestablishing Melting Pot and quit mindlessly celebrating “Diversity”. We also ban some of them from marrying inside their in-group for at least the first generation.

It’s past time to stop being a cultural antirealist.

You know male circumcision is normalized in the United States. It shouldn’t be. Why is it legal while FGM usually is not? Because it has political support. I can see paths where, if we keep going in this direction, FGM becomes normalized and progressively harder to remove from the country. Already we’re on the path it was said we wouldn’t be on.

uncharitable politics nationalism

See, that’s what the app is perfect for.